ksp how to make a stable plane

It is only visible to you. CoL (Blue ball) position relative to CoM (Yellow ball) is very important. It is also said that a good landing is one you can walk away from. 19000m. Then go into the move part thing with the "2" key in the editor, remove the degree setting, and then drag them apart manually and position parts with fine tuning that way. Of course the cargo capacity is less than with a HTOL since you're using some of it to haul those vertical thrusters. (KSP 1.9.1) Subscribe - http://www.youtube.com/c/MikeAben?sub-confirmation=1 Patreon - https://. Another possibility to add to the existing answers (it's a bit hard to diagnose without seeing the plane) is that your landing gear might be insufficient for your plane's mass. +1 for "If that all fails, you may try building your plane lighter and with mightier (or just more) engines, so it just doesn't have the time to start misbehaving on the runway before you bring it up in the air." In 5e D&D and Grim Hollow, how does the Specter transformation affect a human PC in regards to the 'undead' characteristics and spells? All trademarks are property of their respective owners in the US and other countries. Wings have been flown both with and without struts, Wheel friction was even decreased to 0.3 for front wheel and increased to 2.0 for rear wheels, as per a tip found online. what do you mean by "wheels are mounted with angle snapping"? I was a diehard rocketer (5k hours or so) until a month ago and then suddenly got the spaceplane bug, I can now see why some people (*cough*Val*cough*) come out with dozens of designs: it's neat when it works so well. You want to keep the CoL slightly behind the CoM, but not too much to not create torque. Terriers will also work on Duna. However, don't put any fuel tanks on it yet, and empty any fuel-containing parts that you are using. It also depends on whether you're using FAR or another aerodynamic rewrite mod that would change the way your aircraft behave. Unexpected uint64 behaviour 0xFFFF'FFFF'FFFF'FFFF - 1 = 0? one last thing to verify: look from the side, observe where your center of mass is, then how the control surfaces are located relative to it and if the way they react to your controls makes sense (just try to pull up, down, or roll, on the runway without even starting the engine or disengaging brakes and watch which way the control surfaces move). Because they're fun and educational and you can. If it is, you'll never get the nose off the runway. as a rule of thumb they all lose thrust at higher altitudes and at high velocities. For more information, please see our Your previous content has been restored. When off the ground at a sufficient altitude to clear obstacles, main jets ON, When at sufficient speed for aerodynamic flight, hoverjets OFF, pods CLOSED, gear UP. This ensures that your aircraft will go up once it achieves a high enough speed, and also helps with placing ailerons. People put waaaaaaaaay too many control surfaces on things from a lot of the screenshots I see. You've just unlocked "Aviation" tech, you have a bunch of contracts that require you to stay at low altitude, and you want to build your first plane? Keep pitching up as you approach stall speed. Note the landing area markers. These tend to handle . This one is balanced with reaction wheels. But be careful and don't crash it! When your airspeed is low enough that aerodynamic control is getting sluggish. And start small. For most small-to-normal-sized craft, you should end up with CoL sitting right at the back of the yellow CoM ball. A basic tutorial on building a single prop plane. Here's how you go about building a VTOL under these constraints. This would certainly have to be revised once Breaking Ground drops, those parts are extremely relevant for VTOL. By Your airspeed will also fall. Also stock fuel priority is in 1.2, allowing very stable CoM builds. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. May 19, 2013 in KSP1 Tutorials. In other words, your fuel tanks need to be placed symmetrically around the centre of mass so it doesn't shift as the tanks dry, and you need to get your vertical thrust vector exactly aligned with said centre of mass. You arent doing anything wrong. Take the large delta wings and place them on the aircraft. It is certainly possible to make VTOLs that can circumnavigate the planet. There's no tutorial in KSP that explains plane design to you and this guide could have taken the lead on that. Now for the engines. That is really weird. My Hats off to Brikoleur, as a fellow VTOL/general spaceplane [stock] enthusiast, your tips were easy to read and right on the money! The rudder is mostly used when landing and when attempting to line up a shot (in a fighter plane). If the fuel flows from the. Remembering the FW TA152 and the U2 I put long wings on it and while its turn rate makes an airliner look like a fighter plane it is stable enough at 19000m. Cookie Notice Please help, This is an okay guide but it does not go into the nuts and bolts of the deal.like what exactly do all of these wing parts do? Aim to get your speed below 50m/s, and have plenty of water ahead of you; keep the plane level, and pitch up to shed velocity. A Screenshot of Kerbal Space Program. I'm finding it quite surprising you didn't manage to get the plane to fly yet. Reaction wheels will balance smaller craft just fine, but are probably insufficient for bigger ones. 2023 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. Now stick a jet engine on the back, and don't forget to put an . You can park a ship into an elliptical . We look at the principles behind designing a basic jet. I've never found them to be practical (at least on Kerbin) for anything except short flights around the KSC and flying to the island runway and back. As you reach 100m/s, hold S to pull the stick back, and you should be in the air! Starting from something with MK3 hull without experience in MK1 will be an uphill battle. Yes! Arqade is a question and answer site for passionate videogamers on all platforms. You can pick the main cockpit and rotate the whole craft with it in SPH to see where your CoL will drift. If it doesn't, he can just make the stabilizer bigger; instead of turning down control authority, just add more fixed wing. 5. jet engine efficiency in this game is based on built in thrust curves. If his problem is the plane doing backflips at a touch of 's', I wouldn't go with 'slightly'. Thanks for any answers! November 1, 2018 in KSP1 Tutorials. LTTP but anyway: the question is, practical for what? Intakes aren't something usually causing planes to fail, however need some thought. 2 will usually do nicely, but 3 or 4 are usually better (but of course heavier, and this tutorial assumes you use 2). In a twin-boom design, you have one hoverjet at the nose, and one in each of the booms. Plane veering off course is not uncommon but uneven fuel draw can exacerbate it a lot. Before you can make a successful plane, you must understand what makes a plane go in places other than the ground - the wings. You may need to change control authority to a negative value if they bend "the wrong way". This can be most helpful when transitioning to or from level flight. At low speeds, this difference can be significant. 2) Then add the pitch control surfaces. Set up your control scheme: one action group for toggling the hover jets, another action group for toggling the main jets, plus yet another one to toggle the hover jet bays, if you're using them (as you should). The Center of Gravity is ALWAYS above Center of Lift. How to force Unity Editor/TestRunner to run at full speed when in background? Are there any canonical examples of the Prime Directive being broken that aren't shown on screen? She has a horrible turn rate and oscillates a couple of thousand meters at cruise, but it's flyable. Intakes are your friend when you use liquid fuel. Getting all of this into one craft is a pretty intricate business, however. The writing is a bit disjointed, because it's been edited and restructured a few times andI'm not a native english speaker. Getting a plane of the round isn't that hard. RCS will get the job done nicely, and looks cool to boot. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Adding a vertical intake helps. First off, make sure you are using the newest version of Kerbal Space Program, and it is NOT pirated, when you buy it, the devs get helped out. In this tutorial we cover the basics of building and flying a jet in Kerbal Space Program. Subscribe - http://www.youtube.com/c/MikeAben?sub-confirmation=. Nothing bad will happen. You know you don't have enough if you're getting engine flame-outs on take-off or, worse, landing. 3. From your description of your plane I would check the following: You seem to have done a lot of things right. The cargo is near the centre of mass, but because it can shift, it's important to adjust the exact balance by tuning the power on the nose hoverjet At its core, a VTOL aircraft is a plain old aircraft, with downward-pointing jets that produce a TWR of > 1.0 with the vector centred on the craft's centre of mass, and some way of controlling its attitude when it is hovering, because control surfaces do nothing at an airspeed of zero. Next question? On the other hand, something with a wide wingspan but narrow wings (like the connector Cs) will pitch easily but need more oomph to roll. There are a few missions for which a VTOL aircraft is ideal. I haven't found a sure-fire solution to this, but I think I know what causes it. You might still be able to turn very quickly, but if you don't have enough wing you won't drag your velocity vector with you, which means you force your wings into a stall and bleed energy in a hurry (and can also lose control, depending). The solution is to house the hoverjets in a cargo bay of some kind, with the doors opening downwards. I didn't try for 20000m as it probably wouldn't do well. Can you check what happens if you increase the tail size to pull the center of drag back? If you have more than one engine, you can get asymmetric thrust at low speeds. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. Always look at your aircraft from a 90* angle on the side. They can be placed on wings. Also, make sure you read this slowly, some of this stuff may be confusing, but, if you read carefully, I will help you out with what everything means. Yes, although they have only been flown with nearly full tanks. (Yes, you personally, you lucky thing! To do this, take a few barrels of your jet fuel, stick them on the back of your aircraft. Love it!! 2023 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. Does the order of validations and MAC with clear text matter? Smaller wings on the cockpit can be good. The main challenge for hover control is to keep the craft horizontal. @gocket the reason why your solution works is because you are counteracting the imbalance of friction in the wheels as they wobble. Hopefully this gets you your first aircraft that can take off and land, which is the biggest hurdle to being able to make KSP aircraft. rev2023.5.1.43405. Clear editor. The more intakes added, the higher a plane can go before a flame-out, which makes multiple intakes a must on SSTO spaceplanes. http://kerbalspaceprogram.com. 2023 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. My question is really about controllability. Now, get a pair of winglets, and place them at the front of the plane to get that approximate spacing of COM . Standard KSP airplane-stability request: post a screenshot of your airplane in the SPH, with the center-of-mass, center-of-lift, and center-of thrust markers shown. Hint:The engine pre-cooler and engine nacelle are fantastic air intakes, and they can be mounted in-line or combined with other elements. You can "smooth" controls by toggling capslock on your keyboard, the control indicators in the bottom left will turn blue from orange and they are instance dependant (if you revert your flight you'll have to toggle capslock again). That SAS can hold a craft stable doesn't mean it's a stable craft. After the drag was sorted out, it wasn't very hard to create a dockable SSTO version. Ill link it if interested. Now stick a jet engine on the back, and don't forget to put an air intake or other air-sucking device (you can find them in aerodynamics) on the airplane. Turns out it was wheel positioning! The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? A twin-pod design is similar to a twin-boom, except that it has a conventional tail extending from the fuselage. Rockets are much less efficient than air-breathers, so it needs to be much bigger than a Kerbin-bound craft performing the same mission! If you have a perturbation that gives your left engine a tiny bit more thrust, you will turn slightly right. I've covered all my bases, as far as I can tell: It seems if I turn off SAS, I can prevent the oscillation from starting as it's initiated by some control input, whether from me or SAS, but then the plane veers off the runway until it hits something. Control surfaces near center of mass sometimes get "confused" as to their role and do stupid things. What version is the Kerbal Space Program demo? A bigger twin-boom design using two arrays of 18 Junos on each boom and a single array of 9 on the nose. The procedure for a vertical take-off is as follows: The procedure for a short take-off is the same, except that forward jets and hoverjets will both be ON from the start. Congratulations! What are the arguments for/against anonymous authorship of the Gospels. Espaol - Latinoamrica (Spanish - Latin America). TO achieve the easisest way to balance the fuel tanks i never put usable fuel tank in where i cant move ti easily eg. 4. Also hopefully you're not using any mods that use throttle (Throttle Controlled Avionics etc) as with engines as sluggish to react as jet, this is bound to cause trouble. if that does not work, lower the spring strength until it works properly. In vanilla KSP, wings have a predefined lift factor. You are simply running out of atmosphere (i.e. All other versions are slower and lower and unstable in turns. The downside is that it isn't as pretty, but it *does* top out at mach 1.8 with a humble wheesly. 1. In that vein I drag optimized the Karmilla, and added science parts. @TheEnvironmentalist There is one more method I'm sure would work in your case, although I didn't write about it because I think it's cheesy and wouldn't solve the root problem. Then this tutorial is for you. You would need to get down into the 37k-45k zone to aerobrake enough to come down in one orbit. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Also, a good tip: If you use a Panther as a lifting engine, and link the 'Dry/Wet' control to the Stage action group, it allows you to have a lot of control over your lifting thrust (by toggling the Space bar). Your, Add enough downward-pointing jets to lift the plane, as symmetrically as you can around the, Adjust the thrust limiter on the fore (or aft) hoverjets until the thrust vector lines up with the. A V/STOL atmospheric craft built for Duna can drop you on any dime, anywhere on the surface. This item will only be visible in searches to you, your friends, and admins. Before building planes though, there are some inportant things to know. Aircraft are surprisingly difficult beasts to build and control, building a stable, flyable aircraft is surprising complicated, so this is the first of a num. This guide will show how to make simple-ish planes and other aerodynamic tips. You can either go with four "LY-O1 Fixed" or a tricycle of two LY-01 near the back and one "LY-05 Steerable" at the front; either is fine for now. LTTP again (KSP on hiatus for a bit), but here's an answer anyway. So thanks for the pointers - I'll take a look (and try to cure my prejudice re canards). It's a flatbed freighter suitable for shuttling base modules to and from the surface. The second one is likely to be aerodynamics if you just stick on some downward-pointing jets, you will find that they produce a lot of drag, which is going to be really inefficient. I don't have many aerodynamic parts unlocked yet though. Valve Corporation. You may need to add several on bigger craft. Your plane is almost finished. Finally, it is really difficult to land a HTOL atmospheric craft on Duna because of the thin air: you'll be going really fast and terrain is really bumpy, so there's a huge risk of ending up as a big ball of fire, whereas it's very hard to land a conventional rocket lander precisely,like when you're aiming for your surface base. Mount your rear wheels out on the wings for better stability. When braking most of the power should be on the rear, or you may see Kerbin up close. There are multiple ways to place them: Ailerons control the roll of the aircraft, and are (almost) always placed on the wings, as far out as possible and as centered (compared to the center of mass) as could be. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Your CoT vector will disappear. (as in, like 45 degrees) usually resulting in the plane exploding. You should be able to navigate fairly readily, and with the superb efficiency of jet engines, you should have plenty of fuel to go anywhere you need to go. Additionally if you have any off-center fuel tanks, double check the fuel is drawn from both at the same rate (same priority). Pasted as rich text. Drive gently off the runway and use the huge grassy field to take off, without care in the world about the plane veering to a side. The CoM (Center of Mass) is a yellow ball on your spacecraft when you enable it in the SPH. Build yourself a plane. I think it might be so small it starts with floating-point rounding errors; it's exponential and compounds every frame. They both create a dihedral effect, tending to return you to level through a roll-sideslip interaction. Have you noticed this or do you think I might just need more vertical engines when using horizontal intakes only? The buttons show you CoM (Center of Mass, The anvil button), CoL (Center of, Lift, the canard button), and finally CoT (Center of Thrust, the thruster button). They have in common that it's easy to tweak the balance by moving things around, rather than having to add or remove pieces. (if the front gear is the same ditance from the CoM as the 2 rear gears. No, the intakes don't have to be vertical. The absurdly big wing and control surfaces make it highly economical for high-altitude supercruising. So basic, anyone can do it. These tend to handle best. Hi @Brikoleur, nice work! Have you set your control surfaces to only respond to appropriate controls? by fixing the suspension issues the need to sacrifice traction, and in turn, braking power, is not needed. Thanks to this guide I did my first ever landing on the VAB helipad! and our Just like with rockets, get some courageous Kerbal in the cockpit and let's get started! Even exponential growth can take a while to get going if it starts out microscopic, and Id be fascinated to find someone who could figure out a way of measuring the growth rate. Now put on center of mass and center of lift view, and move the delta wings until the center of lift is slightly behind of the center of mass - not in front, otherwise your aircraft will be able to easily flip out of control. The juno 8-pack in a mk2 bay is my go-to, plus, a single Engine nacelle will provide enough air for them all and fuel is self-contained, making the design easy to scale for larger craft. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. Flight records. Move them back and fill them with fuel or weigh them down with control surfaces. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. The BAK Cyclone, delivering a station module to Duna. Is there such a thing as "right to be heard" by the authorities? Powered by Invision Community. To start off with, use ANY cockpit you want, this tutorial is going to teach you how to make anything using anything, as long as you follow these directions. Sorry if this is just too basic, it is kind of for beginners, edit: [snipped the stupid thought] i need to stop trying to post when dead tired, I like rules of thumb like these All the info you need without getting bogged down with specifics, Just a quick FYI, you say that CoL is center of thrust and CoT is center of lift; these are the wrong way around. It may be too far forward, especially if the tail is too small relative to the plane's wings. Which was the first Sci-Fi story to predict obnoxious "robo calls"? You want to start by attaching a Mk 0 Liquid Fuel Tank under the wings, making sure you're mirrored so it goes under both wings. Try not to make your first airplanes longer than 3 MK1 fuselages. Touch down, CUT throttle, CUT engines, BRAKES ON. zombie2u, Because of that if you for example place control surfaces at the front you can make a plane that has CoL behind CoM (like in the picture) unstable because CoL will drift forward past CoM as AoA increases (contrary to your 4th point). Not so with VTOLs: if the CoM shifts, you're not going to be able to land vertically anymore. @TheEnvironmentalist No clue, but it doesn't need to be much because it's a feedback loop. ps2. What is Wario dropping at the end of Super Mario Land 2 and why? I've spent some time scouring the internet for ways of solving this problem, and found a number of pieces of advice on preventing wobble and improving planes in general, some of which made it into the above list, but Valentina's still dying, and I'm tired of Kerbal funerals. All three wheels (one steerable in front, two fixed in back) are mounted with angle snapping, symmetrically, Wheels are mounted to the fuselage, rather than to the wings (which flex under load), Center of lift is behind center of mass, and slightly raised, Rear wheels are in front of tail, but not enough to make tail strikes easy. Also, I would like to know how I can tweak my aircraft to make them smooth at the controls. On 11/1/2018 at 10:54 AM, Brikoleur said: On 1/25/2019 at 4:03 AM, panzerknack said: This thread is quite old. What is this brick with a round back and a stud on the side used for? Also, excessive use of the rudder usually causes the plane to spin out of control and crash. However, don't put any fuel tanks on it yet, and empty any fuel-containing parts that you are using. The CoT (Center of Thrust) is purple. In fact, nothing will happen at all, and that's probably bad, so put an air intake on your plane anyway. Intriguingly, there is one thing I've found that does prevent the wobble from starting, and that is to use a single engine mounted directly on the back of the fuselage, which prevents using a tail and is ultimately a fairly significant restriction to build around. You can also use fine controls with the Caps key, or change control surface sensitivity and assigned movements. You do need rather a lot of them. NEVER go forwards, causing the aircraft to crash itself. I've found that all my runway wiggling planes are caused by the wheels. Lift, the canard button), and finally CoT (Center of Thrust, the thruster button) 2. Keeping it from crashing is usually the hard part. Interesting, though even being exponential theres a chance it starts out so small it takes longer than a takeoff to reach noticeable levels. Sometimes though, planes need to do more complex jobs, like flying farther or making it to space, so I am planning on adding another guide to explain how to make and what to consider in an SSTO spaceplane. Or about the same speed but 1000 m higher. hope you and others find that useful in the future! Better still, three screenshots showing side, top, and rear views. Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. You will need more jets at the nose and tail than on the wingtips, as there will be more forces on pitch when transitioning to or from level flight. Thank you for posting this. Firstly you're going to want to make a short fuselage. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. You want those tires facing straight to the ground! Otherwise tune the suspension to keep takeoff and landing stable. Mach speed - 343 mps. First, @TheEnvironmentalist There is one more method I'm sure would work in your case, although I didn't write about it because I think it's, Hahaha absolutely right, but distinctly less satisfying. I have also used rocket-powered VTOLs on Duna. Eventually you either crash, or you reach a high enough speed that SAS wiggling can't cause a significant enough difference in engine speeds. I only very recently got into planes. Making a fuselage. Usually, having one or two medium-sized intakes will more than suffice on a regular plane. 2023 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. This guide also applies to STOL (Short Take-Off and Landing) aircraft which do their thing using downward-pointing jets or rockets, because they're pretty much the same thing. Ok, you will want to start building. You can post now and register later. You should have something called an "Elevon 1"; this will be the moving part for your wings. Powered by Invision Community. Display as a link instead, (This is key to making a simple functional plane in KSP.) You need to sign in or create an account to do that. 2023 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. also, you state that a stabilizer (you called it a tail) isn't necessary, and although that's true, it's worth noting that a stabilizer is vital in preventing, and recovering, from flat spins, which can be extremely dangerous. Rasterpropmonitor for Kerbal Space Program, How can I cheat docking in Kerbal Space Program. It flames out at 25,000. This reduces the amount of trim you need to apply to get the craft level in flight. Paste as plain text instead, Set the thrust limiter on your main engines to zero. Then you want to put something called a "Small Circular Intake" on the front of the tank, and a "J-20 Juno" engine on the back of the tank. I had my rear wheels mounted on the tail, and it seems the taper of the tail messed up the angle of the wheels creating instability. You would need a lot of orbits at 69 km to come down into the ground. Throttle up to full, activate SAS, stage to start the engine (you'll only have one stage here), and start rolling (or sliding) down the runway! I've had a lot of people comment that their planes veer off the runway or flip around madly even though they think they got everything right. So if you're getting those flame-outs, add more intakes until you don't get them anymore. An aircraft without control surfaces is like a rocket without RCS or reaction wheels - it will hardly turn and will be equally hard to control (perhaps even impossible!). 1. 100% is fine for doing a pure Pilot Assisted flight but for keyboard piloting it's too much. Now right click each elevon and the tail fin and set what movement each controls; the ones on the large wings control roll only, the ones on the back wings control pitch only, and the tail fin controls yaw only. Guest, I've found a few body plans to be especially amenable to conversion to VTOL. I'd start with a lawn arrow that can be hardly pulled up, horrible to maneuver, with CoL way behind, but rock-stable. 2. Elevators are usually places in the front or back of an aircraft, and their function, as the name implies, is to change the pitch of the nose up and down. I haven't encountered oscillations like that in an airplane but I have encountered them aplenty in case of lightweight probes that have too strong control authority - too good RCS or reaction wheels, so I suspect the source here is the same. [1] At this speed it is possible to circumnavigate Kerbin in about 29 minutes at an altitude of 40 km. This plane will be able to take off, travel somewhere, perform a crew report, and then land. Ok, the panther engine is still not good enough. The parts regarding landing gear placement is especially relevant in 1.1.x. principle. I wrote a post that covers similar topics. Finally you need to make sure it's all balanced, this means the centre of lift marker needs to be very slightly behind the centre of mass marker. Pasted as rich text. ps. Embedded hyperlinks in a thesis or research paper.

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